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Author Topic: Are you ready for the overturn of Roe vs Wade?  (Read 190 times)

N3uroTypical

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Are you ready for the overturn of Roe vs Wade?
« on: November 12, 2021, 07:27:17 am »
Our Supreme Court might actually do it.  A 50 year attempt to force a national consensus about when life begins, where there was just no consensus to be had, might be abandoned in the next judicial season which is starting now.

Iím having a hard time wrapping my head around the possibility.  But growing numbers of smart people are suggesting itís coming.  Like constitutional law professor (and one of my favorite AM talk radio hosts for 2 decades) Hugh Hewitt:  https://www.nationalreview.com/magazine/2021/11/29/john-roberts-v-roe/#slide-1

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The entire cobbled-together faÁade of jerry-rigged, ad hoc, and incoherent abortion case law will be swept away, and the half century of strained readings and outright judicial inventions overruled. The repeated attempt by the Supreme Court to legislate at one remove from representative state and federal elected legislatures will, blessedly, end. Abortion will be legal in many states ó even late-term, ďpartial birthĒ abortions ó and, in other states, almost never allowed after a heartbeat is detected in the unborn baby. The Court will walk away from the now obviously failed effort to forge a national consensus by diktat where none can be had.

Iíve got to go study up on prohibition, when the whole nation got together to try to do something, and ended up abandoning the project, giving control back to the states.

Iím in the reading and learning phase right now.  If anyone has any articles on the subject, especially from folks who like Roe and want to see it preserved, please post the links.  I donít want to live in an echo chamber.
What-about-ism is pointless. I like to think most people's responses to such arguments would be, "Yup. That person, who happened to wear the same political jersey I do/did, was totally wrong on that, too."
-Taalcon
 
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Roper

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Re: Are you ready for the overturn of Roe vs Wade?
« Reply #1 on: November 12, 2021, 09:12:35 am »
I don't have any links to articles, yet. I'll share my thoughts:

I watched my twin grandsons, born at 20 weeks and still developing in many ways, struggle for life with every breath. They met the scientific definitions which define life for every species on the planet. That, at least for me, is a starting place for thinking about and discussing this subject.

I really like Jason's observation: Ova are alive. Sperm are alive. They come together and start a new form of life. Life was already there before fertilization.

The "When does life begin?" question is the wrong question. The right question is this: "When do constitutional protections for the right to life begin?" That question is a legal one, not a scientific one, and can be decided through legal means. So, in reality, the issue is determining when the rights of a developing human child get more legal protection than the rights of the mother who is enabling and nurturing that development inside of her own body.

Overall, I believe the church's position is best because it provides justice, mercy, and guidance:

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The Church of Jesus Christ of Latter-day Saints believes in the sanctity of human life. Therefore, the Church opposes elective abortion for personal or social convenience, and counsels its members not to submit to, perform, encourage, pay for, or arrange for such abortions.

The Church allows for possible exceptions for its members when:

Pregnancy results from rape or incest, or

A competent physician determines that the life or health of the mother is in serious jeopardy, or

A competent physician determines that the fetus has severe defects that will not allow the baby to survive beyond birth.

The Church teaches its members that even these rare exceptions do not justify abortion automatically. Abortion is a most serious matter and should be considered only after the persons involved have consulted with their local church leaders and feel through personal prayer that their decision is correct.

The Church has not favored or opposed legislative proposals or public demonstrations concerning abortion.

https://newsroom.churchofjesuschrist.org/official-statement/abortion
« Last Edit: November 12, 2021, 09:14:34 am by Roper »
Education is not preparation for life; education is life itself. - John Dewey
 
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pnr

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Re: Are you ready for the overturn of Roe vs Wade?
« Reply #2 on: November 12, 2021, 12:23:35 pm »
I expect that at least the 24 weeks will be overturned and it will be 20 weeks and probably a new decision tree that doesn't require returning to the supreme court.  (Because I think that they cannot accept the 15 week limit as not based on science and not giving sufficient time for choice.

  But I don't expect the fundamental right to choose will go away (though since it really isn't in the constitution by words it should legally).   I am severely troubled at the laws that force pregnancies through rape/incest/ and when the mother's life is in danger to continue (and suspect those laws only happen because there are too few women in legislatures and some men and some so called religious people cannot see the evil in compounding the evil of rape/incest/and jeopardizing their own life, by removing choice from those already harmed in the circumstances).   
Nauvoo 1270, Feb 2005
 
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Jason

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Re: Are you ready for the overturn of Roe vs Wade?
« Reply #3 on: November 13, 2021, 01:30:43 am »
I think that the conservative justices deference to precedence will not lead to any wholesale overturning of Roe vs Wade. It will likely be sustained 6-3 or 7-2.

I also think that the Supreme Court will overturn the Texas law, but only once it works its way through the courts to hash out the arguments, rather than taking the shortcut route that they tried earlier.
 
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Sweet William

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Re: Are you ready for the overturn of Roe vs Wade?
« Reply #4 on: November 14, 2021, 06:33:25 pm »
Jason is likely correct.

We could have saved the country a whole lot of ugliness if the 1973 SCOTUS had just left the decision up to the states instead of engineering a nationwide mandate via invented "rights" that appear nowhere in the constitution.

Many states were already making allowances based upon the desires of their citizens.  Other states were holding firm, based upon the desires of their citizens.

If they were to overturn Roe V Wade, then the states would go through that process fifty years later, which would have long since been settled by now had they just trusted in the concept of federalism, which did NOT require invention by the SCOTUS.
 
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N3uroTypical

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Re: Are you ready for the overturn of Roe vs Wade?
« Reply #5 on: December 01, 2021, 05:26:32 am »
Iím having a hard time wrapping my head around the possibility.  But growing numbers of smart people are suggesting itís coming.

This article from Politico helps me wrap my head around what might be coming. And what it might mean.

https://www.politico.com/news/2021/11/30/roe-wade-strategy-scotus-abortion-523488
What-about-ism is pointless. I like to think most people's responses to such arguments would be, "Yup. That person, who happened to wear the same political jersey I do/did, was totally wrong on that, too."
-Taalcon
 

 


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