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Author Topic: How do your councils work?  (Read 225 times)

cook

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How do your councils work?
« on: July 14, 2021, 12:32:02 pm »
I thought this was lovely. Something to aim at. What good experiences you've had of different councils / presidencies?

https://www.thechurchnews.com/leaders-and-ministry/2021-07-08/church-councils-president-oaks-eyring-first-presidency-218412
« Last Edit: July 14, 2021, 03:32:43 pm by cook »
 

Sparky

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Re: How do your council's work?
« Reply #1 on: July 14, 2021, 03:15:22 pm »
I hope that it's just that I'm in a contrary mood today, but it seemed to me that in both examples, the "dissenting" or "differing" opinion came around to the council head's opinion. Though there was one section that talked about how two approached a subject from different perspectives, yet came out at the same place, even with a third perspective. In my experience with councils, the person with the differing opinion always has to give in to the leadership's opinion. The differing opinion might be expressed, but it rarely, if ever, sways things to another direction. So, I'm not so sure that sharing differing opinions really makes a difference in councils. It's like the leader has decided on something and that's the way it goes.

But, then again, perhaps I have a poor esteem of ward councils because whenever I have served on them, there are people who will joke or laugh when certain names get brought up for discussion, so there have been times when I have told the Bishop that I don't want my family discussed at ward council about a particular issue I've brought up with him because I don't want there to be that opportunity in a council to be laughed at or derided for whatever reason.

I guess I just don't have a good opinion of councils. Perhaps I just haven't seen them work the way they should, or the way we would hope they would work.
 
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Roper

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Re: How do your council's work?
« Reply #2 on: July 16, 2021, 03:04:42 pm »
In my experience with councils, the person with the differing opinion always has to give in to the leadership's opinion. The differing opinion might be expressed, but it rarely, if ever, sways things to another direction. So, I'm not so sure that sharing differing opinions really makes a difference in councils. It's like the leader has decided on something and that's the way it goes.

Sadly, this has frequently been my experience, as well. I think it depends on the leader, and is not a criticism of the process, however. I have been in councils where someone has voiced a concern or another perspective, and the course of action has completely changed. I believe the process has improved over the past 20 years.

One of the contributing factors: The Same Ten People. In every ward I've been in, there are about ten people who do the majority of the work in the ward. I think that those ten people (especially the bishop) get so used to doing all the work that they quickly decide what needs to be done, do it, and move on to addressing the next need.

Another contributing factor: Perpetual naysayers. In every ward I've been in, there are a few people who criticize every decision, but never offer any alternatives or support. They seem to enjoy playing "devil's advocate," and take it as their personal mission in life to ensure the leader understands every contrary perspective. Look, if you have a valid concern, bring it up. If you're doing it to show everyone else how perceptive and enlightened you are, then I don't have time for your narcissism. I have real work to do.
Education is not preparation for life; education is life itself. - John Dewey
 
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cook

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Re: How do your councils work?
« Reply #3 on: July 23, 2021, 04:17:43 am »
Here's part two

https://www.thechurchnews.com/leaders-and-ministry/2021-07-15/inside-church-headquarters-quorum-of-the-twelve-apostles-218417?utm_campaign=ChurchBeat&utm_medium=email&_hsmi=142562671&_hsenc=p2ANqtz-85mAxtxybb7wBVI_RAPC2ORhcDVIgtUdvgKEqec1JfLobYsFGkGBn26qmweXctkUw0yRdL5yRHcnNJU-GlAy0f6sl9qrET6_m4EcJh3BeeNHAolYg&utm_content=142562671&utm_source=hs_email&fbclid=IwAR0uuqocNKorzKguu7lbE8x_dJxiqb8ZOfkm4m7Dzsd-fWzGJbGJjyrS6bc

There's one exprience when someone having concerns was listened to.

I've had good experiences and mediocre experiences but not bad ones. I've always been listened to and I've seen that the bishop for example has presented and idea and others have disagreed and the idea has not been implemented.

When I went back to work and after a year I was asked to be the other vice principal, after a while working with the principal and the other vice principal and in the executive committee I realized why it was just so easy for me. It was like a presidency and a Ward council. Partly because of the structure but I also noticed I was implementing many of the "good council guidelines" into those.

Now I have a principal that does not work according to those principles and it is hard.

I've been doing some leadership studies and I've also realized that work in the councils is pretty much shared leadership (when done as it should be done) and that must be why I like is so much.
 
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Hobbes

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Re: How do your councils work?
« Reply #4 on: July 27, 2021, 10:25:16 am »
I've been the "no" person in so many different places and callings that I ended up just assuming that's my roll. I tried to have solutions and suggestions rather than just rejection, but really I think my value was being willing to say that more isn't always better. An EQP who thought it would be great for the presidency itself to visit every quorum members home every 3 months. Watching emergency preparedness roll out a new, ambitious plan every 3-5 years and never follow through with any of it. Having a new theme for the ward every few months ("we're going to read the whole Book of Mormon in 6 months, also double sacrament meeting attendance, also baptize someone every week, also..."). I've just constantly (it seems) been put in organizations who felt that since they failed at small to medium goals, the next obvious step is an enormous goals.

Though I have offered suggestions and replacement ideas, I think my actually helpful input is more along the lines of: "OK, you want to do big thing [X]. But we've been trying to do [Y] for years, and despite [Y] being much less significant than [X] we have never succeeded. What will we be doing differently that we can now accomplish [X]? Let's think through all the things we'd need to do if we were to actually realistically accomplish [X]."

I haven't found it gets me a lot of love, though I keep getting those callings so maybe it's appreciated? What I can't stand is to sit in meetings week after week, month after month, where an idea gets thrown out and then it keeps getting expanded on ("Yah, after we [accomplish incredible goal that we haven't even tried to do anything about] we can automate our Facebook pages to broadcast it and then we can have weekly meetings and updates where...") but it's clear no one is actually going to do anything at all. It's like just endlessly discussing what we're going to do with our lotto winnings or something.
 
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